Hi Kent (and his cadre' of loyal red berets!),
Was F.D.R. a murderer, no, a mass murderer? How about Churchill, Isenhower, Montgomery, Macarther, Patton, Bradley, De Gaulle, Napoleon, King Richard I, Julius Caesar, Alexander and so on?
Millions died at some of their commands. Many others fell by the rest.
Millions were saved by their ordering this to happen!
'Suckling babies' died, all to give classless hedonists like you a safe, comfy life in which you judge not only everyone around you but also God!
The world fought a 'just war' where people died screaming in the flames of Dresden (and numerous other cities in Germany and the rest of Europe), Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
There would most probably not be a Jew alive today if not for REAL CHRISTIANS who fought and died for all of us.
The leaders of the Axis countries were allowed by their citizens to commit atrocities upon the innocent. The citizens received what their silence allowed. Their LEADERS were at fault, but so were they.
THEY ALL caused the death of their own children!
Don't pretend that you are any better than or less of a hypocrite than anyone else. Don't pretend you can judge God by a few verses of text.
Rex
Rex B13
JoinedPosts by Rex B13
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Murder?
by Rex B13 inhi kent (and his cadre' of loyal red berets!),.
a murderer, no, a mass murderer?
how about churchill, isenhower, montgomery, macarther, patton, bradley, de gaulle, napoleon, king richard i, julius caesar, alexander and so on?.
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Rex B13
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God not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it
by Kent ingod not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it .
i notice that many people here have claimed that "god is not a murderer.
god does not condone or plan the brutal murder of children!
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Rex B13
You're pretty good at back slapping and hind licking. I'll bet you were one one of the local bully's sidekicks who says, "yea, what he said". Go back and look through your posts!
Rex -
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God not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it
by Kent ingod not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it .
i notice that many people here have claimed that "god is not a murderer.
god does not condone or plan the brutal murder of children!
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Rex B13
If the premise is that God has the three O's, and that IS a requirement for Him to be God Almighty in the first place, then all things are withing His sphere of influence. He allows Satan and evil to go only as far as He wills it but He does not initiate evil. So there is 'determination' and 'allowance' but all is under His ultimate control. 'Free will' is actually minimal.
Rex -
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God not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it
by Kent ingod not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it .
i notice that many people here have claimed that "god is not a murderer.
god does not condone or plan the brutal murder of children!
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Rex B13
OK Dedalus, I'll bite.
>"Attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants" (First Samuel 15:3).
If one understands the passage as literally what God ordered:
1) The Kenites were spared from the judgement.
2) The Amalekites and their possesions were utterly destroyed except for what Saul disobediently wanted to keep.
3) Judgement was decreed due to their hostility toward Israel that related clear back to Exodus.Even in this wonderful, modern world we have things like this happening on an even greater scale...without God ordering it. One can speculate that Israel would not have peace within their own lands while the Amalekites remained in large numbers as a tribe. It was a common thing for the young ones of someone killed to be raised up for vengeance on the offending parties.
"I have loved Jacob and hated Esau" is what we are told in Genesis and the Amalekites were descended from Esau. I can't answer for that.
Children who die are not held of any account by God and their souls are safe with Him, otherwise (in this case) they would have grown up as enemies of Israel and God. One can ask many unanswerable questions and their may be factors that we do not have clear, given the mists of time and the utterly barbaric situations in this ancient age. Divine judgement is the sole providence of God, as is the length of life of each one of us and even the manner of death is foreknown by God. It is by His allowance that man chooses by his own free will to act as he does. The 'free will jabber' is thus explained. The Amalekites chose their course, they and their families reaped the whirlwind.
What happens to civilians in war, even 'righteous wars' like WW2? How many innocent Jews were saved because 60,000 civilians died in Dresden? How many hundreds of thousands (or a million) were saved because of Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Did the German people, even innocents, suffer and die because of their leader's actions? How about the Japanese? Who had the 'free will' to make wise choices instead of tragic? MAN DID THEN AND HE DOES NOW.Some commentators take this account and others like it, as an example of Israel making excuses for their own actions, claiming it was God who ordered the judgement. Many Christians interpret scripture as having to conform to the revelation of Christ in the gospels. If it does not line up with His character it is not literal in their view. In other words, they do not take an 'inerrant word of God' stance.
I wonder why critics do not attack the Flood judgement, it was certainly more all-encompassing regarding the sheer numbers of deaths.>If I ordered my own infant to death, I'm sure you'd think I was pure evil, Rex. So why is it okay when God does it? And how is free will involved in your answer?
That's not an accurate analogy. You are not on the same level as God as you do not know the possible fates of any, including your own infant.
>Uh-huh. So, God had these infants born, which is a miraculous testament to the greatness of his creative powers, only to determine that they must immediately die? Why? And why should that kind of insanity inspire me to worship him?
This 'insanity' is exactly what kind of world people like you and I choose to make. You and I are certainly not superior to, nor better than, any previous generation of man. Why are YOU so self-righteous? You purposely twist 'allowance' and 'determination' in order to judge God by your standards. We really have no idea how much more evil would prevail in this world without any influence of the Holy Spirit. Any who live to see the tribulation period will experience that.
>. This means that morality is utterly subjective to the will of God. Morality is whatever God says it is.
More of the same thing, you seek to judge God by what you say you would do. God, by the very definition of the three O's IS above us and He alone determines His actions. WE have guidelines and can choose to follow them or not. NOT following them got us where we are.
Is a General in the army a murderer? How about the President? Where do we throw in the variables and conditions? Were any of us present, knew all about the situation in Israel or is it just possible we don't have all of the facts?How about it, Dedalus, do you classify every single leader who led an army or a nation as a 'murderer'? I expect an answer to this one!
>Is it okay to stab a person in the eye if you're sure you can restore his sight? I'm not so sure, Rex.
Did Jesus NOT tary when He learned Lazarus was near death? Do I have to tell you the answer?
>Plus, do you really think those infants are now off eating ice cream somewhere in heaven (or whatever)?
Much better than that, I'm sure. This world is the worst we will have of it as Christians or innocents. For the unsaved, it's the best they will have.
>Why would God reward someone he ordered killed? Why would he preserve in spirit a nation he was bent on destorying on earth?
"God so loved the world that He sent His only son to die." God Himself went through everything (and much worse) that we go through, in order that He might pay the price for our sins and rebelliousness. He knew exactly what everyone would go through when He created us out of nothing, in eternity. God the son still lives as a man and is our mediator to God the Father in heaven. Christ was raised in His own transformed, spiritual body, just like we will be!
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Lastly, you keep telling us the Bible is a myth and if that is the case, why do YOU take it literal?
>Kent's reasons for asking the question have nothing to do with the actual answer to the question.
Are you in Kent's head? I know, critics want to harpoon the Bible and still claim it is all a 'myth' or fabrication. The same ones decide ahead of time, that NO MIRACLES nor SUPERNATURAL can happen, then they decide (no duh) that the events of the Bible cannot be true based on that premise, regardless of the evidence! What arrogance.
>So tell me, Rex, have I misunderstood you, or misrepresented you, and if so, where? Can you clear things up at all?
You choose. I do not know.
Hindsight is always 20/20 especially when we do not have the all of the factors, only a few lines of text written by men who lived in a savage world.
Its been pleasant sparring with you!
Rex -
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Deepening Saddness
by Amazing ini look back on the 1970s with a sense of loss and nostalgia.
i was a young man, just married, and so much in love with my beautiful wife.
i had just started my engineering career, and was debt free.
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Rex B13
Hi Amazing,
We are each molded and worked by the Maker's hands and our lives are shaped for His use of us. We are either drawn by the Father to Christ or not. We will side with the skeptics and look forward to a meaningless life then die, leaving our physical bodies behind and passing beyond the veil. What will each of us decide?
I hope that all will consider John 3.16,17; John 3.3; John 14.6; Romans 10.9-11; Eph. 2.8,9 and Rev. 3.20.
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Wife and Sister-in-law
by Undecided ini think my wife and her sister are finally seeing the truth about the churches they have been associated with.
i have been going with them to the church services and pointing out the inconsistences of the dogma that is preached.
i'm not trying to destroy their faith in god but sometimes my comments may seem that way.
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Rex B13
I think that you are only exposing the total rationalist mentality that JWs are trained in. You want everything explained on How God Operates. If you are going to critisize various churches or actual Christian doctrine then you need to read my book list:
Check out some of these links first: http://www.watchman.org/jw/answers.htm Answering Watchtower Objections
http://www.gospelcom.net/apologeticsindex/t03.html The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of the Trinity by Robert Bowman
http://www.gospelcom.net/apologeticsindex/t10.html The Doctrine of the Trinity
http://answering-islam.org.uk/Trinity/beckwith.html The Trinity by Francis J Beckwith
http://www.probe.org/docs/bel-trin.html Why We Should Believe in the Trinity Pat Zuckeran
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/9t8/9t8072.html Writing the Trinity Philip Yancey
http://www.atlantaapologist.org/Sharp.html A Bicentennial Defense of Granville Sharp's Argument for the Deity of Christ.You will have some of the 'glaring inconsistencies' answered, then:
Christianity: a Witness of History......J.N. Anderson
the New Testament Documents: Are They Reliable?......F.F. Bruce
Evidence That Demands a Verdict (1 & 2)........Josh McDowell
History and Christianity........John Montgomery
Basic Christianity..........John Stott
Bible Explorer's Guide......John Phillips
Mere Christianity.........C.S. LewisRead the last book first. I have demonstrated to some here how the ideas that JWs have about the valid doctrines of the Bible are false and easily refuted. JWs are taught to arrogantly think their basic beliefs are true and the orthodox beliefs are not.
Ron Rhodes book on 'Reasoning from the Scriptures' absolutely debunks JW assertions and probably some of your own notions will pop up. I wish you well. May you find God again, brother.
Rex -
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God not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it
by Kent ingod not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it .
i notice that many people here have claimed that "god is not a murderer.
god does not condone or plan the brutal murder of children!
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Rex B13
Kent and Shaneliza,
When are you going to realize your witty little ditties are 'old news' and have been answered ever since the first atheist crawled from under a rock?
Ha! I got you going and it must have been a 'raw nerve', eh Kent baby?
You don't like it when you are exposed for the actual minimal knowledge of Biblical interpretation you have, do you?
You will die on the very instant that God has already determined and that absolutely frustrates you. You are in the same boat, in or out of the Watchtower.
Then, you shout out vulgarities and cry like a 12 year old who just got his butt whipped. bwahhhhhhhh
Well at least you have your own little cadre' of followers. You are famous amongst a few for as long as this place and similiar ones exist. That will end when the WBTS finally goes mainstream or splits, losing the blood, df and shunning issues will force you into a new hobby. No one will care about your web site and crude attitude toward the people you help prey on.
Yep, you prey on those who are trying to leave the Borg. You are there waiting as the exact image of what the WBTS calls an 'apostate'. I wonder how many more would have left NOT meeting your posts online?
You don't even realize that you are just what the Society wants JWs online to see! You prove them RIGHT.
Rex -
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How would you respond to this?
by openminded ini got this letter today from a friend of my dad who i have not seen in years.
please respond to any or all of it as you see fit.
it pretty much sums up witness mentality.
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Rex B13
This is a letter that I sent to my dad and mom and am going to send to my grandma in the latest draft. I don't know how much scripture you are familiar with.
Hi Dad!
We really enjoyed our time together. We would also like to ease your concern over our future. You see, we have all dedicated our lives to Jesus as the following scriptures indicate we should do.
How does one obtain salvation? Is it through our own works or the works that others tell us are needed? Not according to scripture. I found out exactly what the original gospel (good news) actually is:
NIV 1 Corinthians 15:1-4
1 Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand.
2 By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
3 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance : that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.This is the gospel and are we as Jehovah's witnesses preaching this? If not who gave us permission to change the gospel message? How then are we to be saved? Ever since our Lord ascended to heaven the 'end' could have arrived at any time (one can see that the apostles expected it in their day). Preaching an 'end times' message is not the gospel that the apostles preached, it is only one part of the teachings in scripture. I say this out of my love for the Lord and NOT to discourage you. We love you and want to see you happy.
NIV Ephesians 2:4-9
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy,
5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.
6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
Grace is defined as something undeserved and given to us by God when we accept Jesus as our savior, we become a 'new creation' (Romans 3) and are 'born again' (John 3.3). Is their anything wrong with 'works', no. Works are an evidence of our faith and not vice-versa. The whole book of Romans makes this abundantly clear. Read it carefully and pray for God to guide your steps.NIV Romans 3:22-24
22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
24 and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.
Again this is confirmed.NIV John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
NO exceptions, NO hint of any future select few who would claim to do so.
From Romans 10:
4 Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.
5 Moses describes in this way the righteousness that is by the law: "The man who does these things will live by them."
6 But the righteousness that is by faith says: "Do not say in your heart, `Who will ascend into heaven?' " (that is, to bring Christ down)
7 "or `Who will descend into the deep?' " (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).
8 But what does it say? "The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart," that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming:
9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.
11 As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame."
12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile--the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,
13 for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."That is pretty clear wording from the inspired apostle Paul regarding salvation. There is nothing in scripture that indicates one man or a group of men can claim otherwise. So, who will teach us the truth?
NIV John 14:25-29
25 "All this I have spoken while still with you.
26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.
27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
We are all to be taught by the Holy Spirit when we receive salvation by dedicating our lives to obedience to our Lord. Does that mean that all Christians will agree on the meaning of absolutely every scripture? On the non-essentials the answer is no, we can see this in the early Christian congregations. There are matters that cause differences due to our imperfection.
God has many houses for mankind to worship Him (the wheat and the tares parable) and there is no reason to think that one group can claim to have 'special knowledge' for there are many groups that claim this very thing.
In evangelical Christianty there is almost universal agreement on the requirements (that I listed above) for one to be saved. I would be happy to pray with you as you ask Jesus into your heart and gain salvation that will be assured and not determined by anyone who claims to have sole possesion of 'truth'.NIV Titus 3:5-7
5 he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,
6 whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.NIV Romans 5:4-5
4 perseverance, character; and character, hope.
5 And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.Their is really no justification in scripture that separates one class of Christians from another. If we were to take the 144,000 as a literal limit (for heavenly hope), why do we not also say they must be jewish males from the twelve tribes? Why also is the 'great multitude' right there in heaven along with the 144,000, the 24 elders, the Lamb of God and the throne of God? The scriptures regarding the 'last days' also point toward a highly visible return of Jesus (in the clouds in glory and those alive will be caught up with him into heaven:
1 Thes. 4
16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.NIV Revelation 1:7-8
7 Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him (those who pierced him are long dead yet they will see him too!) ; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen.
8 "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."His return will also be at the start of the great tribulation and not many years before:
Mark 13:
21 At that time if anyone says to you, `Look, here is the Christ !' or, `Look, there he is!' do not believe it.
22 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform signs and miracles to deceive the elect--if that were possible.
23 So be on your guard; I have told you everything ahead of time.
24 "But in those days, following that distress, "`the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light;
25 the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.'
26 "At that time men will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory.How are we to view those who have prophesied falsely? When someone claims that they speak for God then make predictions that do not come true?
NIV Deuteronomy 18:20-22
20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death."
21 You may say to yourselves, "How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD?"
22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.While Jesus was still with his disciples on earth, He spoke to them about heavenly life:
Let not your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In my Father's house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also. (John 14:1-3)
Maybe you are saying, "I don't have the desire to go to heaven. I would rather live on a cleansed earth." Did you know that the apostles felt this way as well, at least before Pentecost? The Bible doesn't indicate their desire to be in heaven up until then. Often they did desire the prestige of the kingdom that Jesus spoke about, such as when the mother of James and John asked for them to sit at Jesus' right and left hand in the kingdom (Matt. 20:21). But the disciples continually visualized a conventional earthly kingdom of some sort, and felt that it would be realized back then. Luke 19:11 relates:
And while they were listening to these things, He went on to tell a parable, because He was near Jerusalem, and they supposed that the kingdom of God was going to appear immediately.
Even after Jesus' death and resurrection they held onto this idea, and Acts 1:6 says:
And so when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?"
Only years later do we find the apostle speaking from the heart about their hope in the heavens. Notice the following expressions:
...And raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus... -Eph. 2:6
The Lord will deliver me from every evil deed, and will bring me safely to His heavenly kingdom; to Him be the glory forever and ever. -II Tim. 4:18
Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider Jesus, the Apostle and High Priest of our confession. -Heb. 3:1
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. -Phil. 3:20
...Because of the hope laid up for you in heaven, of which you previously heard in the word of truth, the gospel. -Col. 1:5
...To obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you. -I Peter 1:4
Did God give these disciples of Jesus a supernatural desire to go to heaven rather than to live on earth, as the Watchtower teaches? No such miraculous desire is indicated in the Bible. Rather, their desire was simply based upon wanting to be with Jesus again, wherever He was. Rev. 14:4 says that "These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever he goes." They had come to know and love Jesus dearly, and simply wanted to be with Him. If He was going to heaven, they wanted to be there with Him.
When Stephen was stoned, he knew that he was going to be with the Lord. He saw Him seated at the right hand of the throne of God in heaven in a vision and prayed, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit" (Acts 7:59).
In John 14:1-3 Jesus likens their going to heaven as "coming home" to be with Him and the Father. In 2 Cor. 5:6-9 the apostle Paul refers to his "going home to be with the Lord."
Simply stated, a true Christian desires to go to heaven because he has been cultivating a loving relationship with Jesus Christ, and he not only wants to be with Him some day, and treasures such a promise, but is appalled at the thought of missing out on such a promise.
Having such a desire is based upon a personal relationship, and not on a preference for physical surroundings, as the Watchtower suggests. For instance: A young man in California falls in love with a beautiful young girl and wants to marry her. Then she moves to New York. Although the young man is quite comfortable in California and does not know what to expect in New York, his desire is to be with the one he loves. He doesn't go out of love for New York, for he knows nothing about the place.
So it is with the one who truly belongs to Christ. He does not know anything about heaven or what to expect there, nor does any man. But he knows his Lord, and he wants to be with Him. This is precisely why Jesus promised what He did in John 14:1-3 (quoted earlier).
So what if we have no desire to go to heaven? Obviously we have been feeding on the wrong spiritual food. Instead of feeding on the Word of life and the promises given to us by Jesus, we may have been feeding on the doctrines of men who endeavor to steal the promises of God away from us. Gal. 1:6-7 warns us:
I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ, for a different gospel; which is really not another; only there are some who are disturbing you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
What should we then do? Well, just as a woman should know her head (her husband), so we must also know our head, Jesus Christ. As Christians, we are promised in spiritual marriage to Him. Looking at it that way makes this a very serious matter.
One Body with One Hope
First of all, we need to clarify why all Christians will one day be together. In John 15, Jesus likens Himself to a vine, with the Father being the cultivator. His disciples were to be the branches, attached to their head, which is Christ. If they reveal themselves as not being true children of God, they are "lopped off."
Those who have truly put their faith in Him will be refined and bear fruit. In verses 4-6, Jesus reveals how we must "remain in Him" or "abide in Him."
Paul illustrates this further. 1 Cor. 12:27 says, "Now you are Christ's body, and individually members of it." Verses 12 and 13 say: "For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit." Paul is saying that the individual parts of a body are all attached to the head; and the final result is that the body will function smoothly as one.
Paul also tells how Christ gave gifts to men in order to build up this "body of Christ":
And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ. . . we are to grow up in all aspects in Him, who is the head, even Christ, from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by that which every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love. -Eph. 4:11, 12, 15-16
Verse 4 of the same chapter says: "There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism."
So it is very clear that there is actually only one body of Christ, made up of true believers, and they all have only ONE HOPE. What is that hope? It is the final functioning as a perfect "body" in heaven alongside their Lord and Master. To one who has truly become a part of the body of Christ, the thought of being separate from their Lord and their head is frightful indeed. True Christians have a strong desire to be with their Lord in Spirit, and one day in His physical presence. This is not a desire that develops due to spiritual pride or religious fervor, but it develops in the same way as a natural affection between two persons who are in love.
How many "bodies" of Christ are there? How many hopes have been set out for Christians? How many callings? Let us not be deceived by the clever trickery of men. Jesus warned in John 10:7-9:
Jesus therefore said to them again, "Truly, truly I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. All who came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them. I am the door; if anyone enters through Me, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture."
How does one know if he is a part of the body of Christ? In John 3:3 Jesus said, "Truly, truly I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." And in verse 5 He says, "unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." The key would be being "born of the Spirit"--being begotten as one of God's spiritual sons.
The work of the Holy Spirit is to testify about our hope in Christ. The Holy Spirit brings conviction upon our hearts, to personally reveal to us how sinful and wretched we really are without the blood of Christ to cover us. We must come face-to-face with the stark realization that nothing we can do of ourselves can please God; for we cannot justify ourselves before God (Rom. 3:20). We deserve death (Rom. 6:23). We must personally ask Christ to cover our sins once and for all; and to make us into a new man in union with Him. The Holy Spirit has to bring a conviction on our hearts, and we either follow through or reject this work of the Holy Spirit. As we follow through and ask the Lord Jesus to share His life with us, we are then born of the Spirit. It is all of His work; He has begun it in our hearts with conviction, and is completing it by dwelling in us permanently through the Spirit.
This is not always an emotional experience. God does not often work by "feelings." But we do thereafter begin to notice real changes in us. We are aware of another influence with us--encouraging us on in a right course, and molding us and disciplining us. It is none other than our Lord and Savior Jesus. We feel a new life within us, according to Rom. 8:11:
But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who indwells you.
You are now a son of God according to verse 14: "For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God." You have the hope of sharing with Him; you are now part of the body of Christ; you are an heir to all of the blessings that He has to give. Verses 16 and 17 says:
The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him in order that we may also be glorified with Him.
If you are sensitive to it, you will realize that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit now live with you and have made their home within you in Spirit, according to John 14:17-23:
. . . the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you, and will be in you. I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. After a little while the world will behold Me no more; but you will behold Me; because I live, you shall live also. In that day you shall know that I am in my Father, and you in Me, and I in you.
. . . he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I will love him, and will disclose Myself to him. . . . If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him, and make Our abode with him.
What would Christians do in heaven? Other than worshiping the Lord (Rev. 15:3-4), the Bible also reveals that we shall reign with Christ as kings and priests (Rev. 20:6). Perhaps, as Rev. 5:10 suggests, we will one day reign upon the earth, as the literal Greek renders it. This would also harmonize with Rev. 21:2-3, which after speaking of a new heavens and a new earth, says:
And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He shall dwell among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself shall be among them."
It literally says that God will dwell among His people on the earth. Who is none other than "God manifest in the flesh" but Christ himself?
The new earth shall remain forever. The glorified body of Christ will apparently have access to it. The book of Revelation is a book of prophecy that remains to be fully understood, but one thing is for sure: Those who have put their faith and trust in the Lamb's promises and look forward to sharing with Him will abide forever.Rex
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testing my patience
by Mommie Dark ini got an unsolicited email from a dub recently.
she read my stories at free minds and recognized one of the characters.
my brief reply was taken as an excuse to question me about the possibility of my returning to the jws.
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Rex B13
>This is the point I was trying to get across to someone when they expressed great concern about my revelation of no longer considering myself a Christian. Their attitude was insulting, insinuating that my lifestyle might radically change into one of selfish debauchery (not the exact phrase they used, but it sums it up) without the fear of a deity. I suppose it is an attitude prevalant in the Christian faith, but only amplified in high-control groups like the WTS.
You too miss one of the points. You (nor is anyone) are not and never have been a Christian. You were attempting to follow the leader and 'behave' like you thought a Christian should, without the guidance of the Holy Spirit. You aren't a Christian until you love Jesus and follow Him alone. Just getting 'fire insurance' against God's wrath is not what it takes to be a Christian.
You might want to review Romans 3.23; 6.23; 10.9-11; John 3.3; 3:16,17; 15.5-8; 8.31-32; 13.34-35, Ephesians 2.8,9, Rev. 3.20. Also, get a legitimate translation to read out of...
Rex -
89
God not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it
by Kent ingod not only condoned mass murder, he ordered it .
i notice that many people here have claimed that "god is not a murderer.
god does not condone or plan the brutal murder of children!
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Rex B13
As usual, you seem NOT to understand that God determines how long each one of us live. We are predestined to our limited time and have only enough free will to choose eternal life or eternal damnation.
We all will die on the day that God has determined. Is that so hard to get through your alcohol & drug addled brain?
You're taking what many consider to be Hebrew apologetics over their own sins and making it apply to all Christians. Even if the passages ARE literal it is within divine providence to judge creation!
Next, you make the same JW error over and over, ignoring the fact that the soul is immortal and we suffer only a physical death. Some people are better off dead, are they not, Kent baby?
Lastly, you keep telling us the Bible is a myth and if that is the case, why do YOU take it literal?
Rex